Denaes Posted March 13, 2004 Posted March 13, 2004 http://www.halcyonsoft.com/products.asp?s=4 Java based .Net framework. Runs on any machine that supports Java 1.4 (or is it 1.3?). Runs on Linux, PC, OS 9, OS X, etc Though one look at the "Flexible" pricing modules and you may not want to veer past your 30 day free trial. For once I wish MS would just buy the stupid rights to the software and distribute it cheaply. :D Quote
dragon4spy Posted March 13, 2004 Posted March 13, 2004 (edited) Microsoft has agreed with Corel to make .net framework for Linux, or even Mac. I think I would rather wait for free .net frameworks from MS than spending 20k buck buying iNet. Cos according to google, almost home and office users are using windows platforms. Linux, however, plays an important role in server market. :D Edited March 13, 2004 by dragon4spy Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
Denaes Posted March 13, 2004 Author Posted March 13, 2004 Oh, I get it. Its not the framework that is crossplatform, its really a .Net to Java converter. It converts your .Net application into a java compatable program! Well that certainly makes more sense to convert apps over to Java than to purchase a $5,000 liscense just to run a .net program... I was wondering how that was supposed to help schools, buying 30 $2,500 liscenses (50% discount)... 75,000 for a classroom that would have been. I wonder if you can do this to sourcecode or to already compiled .net programs... Quote
dragon4spy Posted March 13, 2004 Posted March 13, 2004 a compiled .net one, IL codes. Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
irasmith Posted March 13, 2004 Posted March 13, 2004 dragon4spy, do you have any information or sources to the refernece you made Microsoft has agreed with Corel to make .net framework for Linux, or even Mac. ? It's not that I doubt you or think you are wrong. I think this is great news and I was just courious as to the source of the information so I can read it myself and watch the source for future information about it. As a developer I was hoping that something would happen to allow .NET programs to run in other environments other than MS. If this actually does happen then I can program away with confidence and not have to watch/wonder or try to hedge my bets on which environemnt I would have to cater to in order to get my application(s) sold to the broadest market base. I do agree with you, I would rather wait for either a free tool to be made available or for it to drop in price some as I personally can't afford the so far discussed prices to attempt to have mass distribution of the things I would write. Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
dragon4spy Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Here you go. http://www.dnjonline.com/newsreel/DotNet_for_Linux.html Google "Corel Microsoft .Net Framework Agreement" Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
*Experts* Volte Posted March 14, 2004 *Experts* Posted March 14, 2004 On a somewhat related note, http://www.go-mono.org/ Quote
irasmith Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Thanks for the link on the news story about the Corel-Microsoft deal. I noticed that it was dated October 2000 and the story indicated the deal would be good for three years. I haven't heard anything from Microsoft or Corel on the matter and wonder what is up. Perhaps the Mono project is what is going to be used instead of the Corel-Microsoft deal. I'll keep watching as I wade further into .NET and see what happens. Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
dragon4spy Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 (edited) According to Mono project's timeline, C# compiler for linux will be available in late 2004 (framwork v1.0). Vb.net compiler for linux will be available in early 2005 (framework v1.2), and most-complete .net framework for linux (v1.4) will be available in late 2005. I'm doubt what those C# and vb.net compilers used for? Since the compiled code in windows .net compiler is in IL codes, so what is needed to run on Linux platform is only a .net framework. Thus, Is mono a compiler or a framework for Linux? Edited March 14, 2004 by dragon4spy Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
irasmith Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Actually, Mono is going to have both elements incorporated into it. It is/will be a compiler so developers can use it to write code and compile it down to IL, and it has/will have the .NET framework for it so that the IL can be executed under the Linux environment. At least this is my understanding of things as I look at what is on the site about it. I can see the 'why' to this so that a developer who seeks to work in a Linux environment can develop in that environment and their work be runable in the MS environment. Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
dragon4spy Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Oh I see... :D So how about dotNet IDE in Linux? As far as I know, Mono won't have one, or maybe other projects, or Microsoft will make one? Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
Denaes Posted March 14, 2004 Author Posted March 14, 2004 Oh I see... :D So how about dotNet IDE in Linux? As far as I know' date=' Mono won't have one, or maybe other projects, or Microsoft will make one?[/quote'] http://www.monodevelop.com/screenshots.aspx They've already released an early beta IDE for Mono/Linux. Its starting to look like if you want real crossplatform action in the forseeable future, you need to deal in C#. All the .Net stuff should be able to be run on Mono, but as far as compiling with Mono, C# is way further ahead of VB.Net. -Edit- Nothing makes me feel stupider than looking at linux jargin. Its probobly not too complicated, but its like 100% different from windows. I'd probobly need a "Linux for Dummies" to translate what all the filetypes are and everything. :D Quote
dragon4spy Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Linux is a completely new system for me. I used it for a month, but now I can't even install a software. How then? In those .gz things :D. It will be difficult for me to start programming in Linux. Maybe I need to catch C++ first. Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
irasmith Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 If all goes well on the Mono side, then you yourself will not have to worry about learning how to program in Linux. You can use MS and the VS.NET IDE to program and compile in. You can then take the compiled files and users can install them on MS or Linux. Right now the only real thing I wold think a person would need to learn is how to package their programs up for deployment on Linux. You might not have to even worry about deployment if somehow they come up with a way of doing �universal� packaging like some systems for Java do. I can't say with certainity since I haven't worked with Mono yet but it will be interesting to see how things progress :) Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
Denaes Posted March 14, 2004 Author Posted March 14, 2004 If all goes well on the Mono side, then you yourself will not have to worry about learning how to program in Linux. You can use MS and the VS.NET IDE to program and compile in. You can then take the compiled files and users can install them on MS or Linux. Right now the only real thing I wold think a person would need to learn is how to package their programs up for deployment on Linux. You might not have to even worry about deployment if somehow they come up with a way of doing �universal� packaging like some systems for Java do. I can't say with certainity since I haven't worked with Mono yet but it will be interesting to see how things progress :) For the most part, deploying a .Net project is just copying a directory with your program in it. The Mono would handle the copy operations in theory. You might need to learn some conventions... Isn't Linux not allowed to have spaces in filenames? Stuff like that. Mono should act as the inerpreter and all the developer would need to do is code in a .Net language or IL and mono will do the rest. Quote
irasmith Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 You might be right regarding the no spaces allowed in file names. I can't say for certain as I haven't worked in Linux yet. My background has been SCO Unix, IBM AIX, and the Windows world in terms of servers starting with NT3.5 on up. My home setup consists of a Win XP Pro box and a SCO Open Server box (yes I bought my own copy of SCO Unix several years back ;) ) The only Linux experience I have is working with it remotely for my web site as my hosting provider where my Post Nuke webiste is located at runs Linux. While I have learned some that way it is not the same thing as having my own box and working with it as the actual admin and such. I am wanting to take the Linux plunge, the timing of it will just depend on the status of cash on hand and what I need to allocate out to a few necessary things that must be taken care of before that. What has appealed to me to want to try Linux out is the Mono project and the thought that my .NET work would be useable under both MS and Linux. I looked at the SCO offerings and couldn't find a thing about any type of work they were doing to provide .NET useability with their system so that has been the main reason I may not stay with SCO myself. You are correct, at least from my view, that Mono should be able to do the rest and we just code. At least that is my impression of what they are aiming for as I review the information on their site. Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
Denaes Posted March 14, 2004 Author Posted March 14, 2004 I'm waiting for two things to make a move to OS X or Linux. A professional (ie, fully implimented and few bugs) .Net IDE. Macromedia Flash (preferrably the whole Macromedia Studio). OS X already has the whole Macromedia Studio, but I see no plans in any forseeable future of it getting a professional .Net IDE. Linux has neither, but is promising both. Macromedia is helping to support Macromedia Flash emulation on WINE (Windows Emulator for Linux) and looking into developing a native Flash (or whole studio) support for linux. Linux also has that .001 beta of a C# IDE, so theres a real possibility. Other than that, what do I use a computer for? Watching movies? Internet? Buisiness Bookkeeping? All that is already possible on Linux. I just need to make sure my All-in-one printer/scanner/fax is supported and I think I'm set to go. But programming is my primary use for my computer and both Flash and .Net both solve different problems. Quote
irasmith Posted March 14, 2004 Posted March 14, 2004 Sounds like you are just about ready to go then. Yes, I had heard about the initial Macromedia statement to bring certain parts to WINE with the possible intent on making a port of their full suite for Linux itself. I don't have the news article bookmarked but I do recall reading their head fellow making a statement something like "We have been waiting for the right time and now that time seems to have arrived." This is a good time to be in the computing field. There is so many new things being developed, so many new technologies to work with, and so much that you can do with it all. I really enjoy working in this field. :) Quote Ira Richard Smith IraRichardSmith.Net
Denaes Posted March 15, 2004 Author Posted March 15, 2004 This is a good time to be in the computing field. There is so many new things being developed' date=' so many new technologies to work with, and so much that you can do with it all. I really enjoy working in this field. :)[/quote'] Eh, I find it all very depressing. 10 years ago people said the same thing. In 10 years people will again say the same thing, and comment on how sad it was for people 10 years ago (now) to think we were lucky. :D Quote
samsmithnz Posted March 15, 2004 Posted March 15, 2004 Linux is a completely new system for me. I used it for a month, but now I can't even install a software. How then? In those .gz things :D. It will be difficult for me to start programming in Linux. Maybe I need to catch C++ first. Don't even get me started on those .gz.tar things... Quote Thanks Sam http://www.samsmith.co.nz
*Experts* Volte Posted March 15, 2004 *Experts* Posted March 15, 2004 .tar compresses a bunch of files at once, and .gz can only do one at a time, so you mix them and you get a nicely compressed file. Any half decent archive program (in Linux or Windows) can do it automatically. Quote
dragon4spy Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 I h*te everything in Linux, except its GUI look and feel. Cool... I remember I can use windows in just a day or two without any teaching, but months and months for Linux. In addition to .gz.tar, there are also aliens devices (??) in /dev (?). Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
*Experts* Volte Posted March 16, 2004 *Experts* Posted March 16, 2004 It's not an OS meant for the end-user. If you don't like it, don't use it. Quote
dragon4spy Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 Sure I am :D Quote Don't judge a man by his look. Don't judge a book by its cover. :D
Denaes Posted March 16, 2004 Author Posted March 16, 2004 I h*te everything in Linux, except its GUI look and feel. Cool... I remember I can use windows in just a day or two without any teaching, but months and months for Linux. In addition to .gz.tar, there are also aliens devices (??) in /dev (?). Well, which version? I think there are like 10-15 major versions and about a hundred times as many minor versions. Some are very similar, some are radically different. Some are all command prompt like dos, with others you need to search to find the command prompt, its hidden under the GUI so well. If you want an "Easy" Linux experience, you might want to try Lindows. Its a linux implimentation of windows, ment for novices/windows users. you can find it at http://www.lindows.com, and it also ships with cheap $200 PCs from walmart (got one for my mother-in-law, but lindows didn't work with the monitor we had, so we had to install windows 2000 anyway, nice computer for the price, if cheap perriphials. The mouse was crap). This is so Windowslike that the linux community as a whole pretty much hates it a little more than windows. Its worse because its Linux tying to be windows! I can say a lot of bad things about windows and have a lot of annoyances, but PlugNPlay sure as hell beats writing your own configuration for each device. For the most part, I want to spend my computer time being productive, not fiddling with the OS to try to make it work. Quote
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