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And Microsoft's reasoning, from what I heard...?
C# developers didn't ask for it, so they figured why put it in. Ugh... (going off to complain about squeaky wheels getting the grease)

-Nerseus
 
D'oh, so if we don't ask for it we don't get it???? that's so.... better not put that last word
 
At the moment though the choice of languages can be a good thing - without the C# crowd looking down on VB as a 'toy' language. Also in the current state the differences between the languages are quite minor.
If the languages start to diverge (Edit and Contine, Default Instances on Forms etc) then supporting and using both languages will become more of a chore (especially if you are not in a position to choose a language).
 
Very true on your comments and I in part in my post was just putting a bit of light hearted humor into things.

I'm new to .NET but I can see already some of the minor differences between C# and VB.NET. I had actually begun mystudies with VB.NET and then things changed at work and the decision was made to go the C# route instead. So I changed the direction of my studies and am now getting absorbed in C#.

Even if the languages do diverge over time and grow farther apart, the underlying .NET framework will still be the same. I realize right now with only minor differences between them it is easy to learn, support, and program applications in either or both of them. I too would hate to loose that vantage as at this point I would still like to pick back up on VB.NET studies at a later point in time. Guess I like to be flexible to handle a lot of situations. But I won't get discouraged over it. I'll keep on with C# and use class library approach to things if need be to get my workings to work with VB.NET programs others write.
 
I personally think that this is just some attempt to get another C++ish language out there, so that VB has some other language to roll its eyes at and to get eyes rolled at it too... I don't feel that VB should be made handicapped/all the special treatment just because it was meant to be simple, but I bet that you knew that already, so I won't go any further. I'll continue to use VB.NET and C# since I like them both...

unless they try to make a VB# (oh bother) :-\?
 
Coming from an ex-VB6er - and so happy I upgraded to C# - IMO vb'ers are people who really don't know what they're doing, if they did, then they would probably not look at you like a deer caught in headlights when you mention OO... therefore they deserve to be cast down - just kidding - but really, a majority of VB.NET users are people 'playing' with programming - it's an introduction I think to the programming world - it was for me - they're not serious, at least not yet - and I think if you look through the posts you will agree that 95% of the stupid questions... and I like I said in my Rant about Rants in suggestions, there is such a thing.... they come from VB users - I know, I was one of them asking the stupid question a few years ago (and I still do sometimes...)! But I think if you like VB, and the programming bug gets you, you'll move into C# with the proper motivation... it's the natural move I think, and after doing C# for a while it just seems so much more natural than VB, like 'this feels right', 'this looks right', 'this is how it should be'. I think VB.NET is too powerful for new programmers - too much to take in at once, not click, drag, and go like VB6 was, thus I believe this is a part of Microsoft dumbing it back down. I changed to C# because VB.NET seemed like a whole nother language to me compared to VB6 with all these new phrases like Inheritance and Polymorphism and Marshaling and a buddy of mine, who started back in the 80s with straight C and assembly stuff told me to take this oppurtunity to jump into the C based languages since I was going to have to learn about that stuff anyway... that C# wasn't as difficult as C++ (your only other option before C#) but a true C syntax based programming language that would teach me the essentials and help me understand the lower level programming that is involved in C++, C, and Assembly - and that was the best peice of advise I ever followed. I have learned 10 fold in C# what I would of learned just crossing to VB.NET. VB users are beginners trying out the water I think, and there's nothing wrong with that!, C# users are people who want to make this a career.
 
PlausiblyDamp, good observation, I really hope that they don't dummy-up VB too much, I find that it's already there.

bri189a, you are off much more than you're on.
 
Please let us not attempt to place one over the other in the family of .NET languages. I have never been a person on either end of the extreme, I'm rather a middle-of-the-road type of guy. So I feel for each there is a time and a place or purpose that it is best suited for.

Actually, in my initial readings before deciding to devote time and effort to .NET, I noticed some authors were even suggesting that other langauge vendors port their languages over to the .NET platform. Perhaps I am a bit miss-guided in my thinking, but to this newbie it would seem that the language itself wouldn't matter so much if it was true to the .NET platform. Now how pratical it would be to port other languages over to .NET I don't know, but for those of us who are explore things and dream of the possibilities, that option does hold potential.

For those of us who are Trekies, you could almost view the .NET platform as the universal translator allowing diverse inputs but providing output that we all understand.

Also, another way to look at it is in the cost factor. When I was shopping around I noticed that most of the time the price of an individual language professional edition was very close to the price of the VS.NET Professional edition. In the end, I opted to buy VS.NET. Figured it only made sense because with it I get all the .NET languages so I am set to learn as few or as many as I desire to devote my time to.

And by the way, I really enjoyed IcePlugs comment of 'oh bother'. Very much said the way my childhood and adulthood hero Pooh would put things. Nothing ever seemed to trouble Mr. Pooh very much. He held steady to his constant search for honey and enjoyed the company of his friends along the way.

So let us enjoy our quest for knowledge and enjoy each others company along the way.;)
 
Robby - nothing new there... that's why I got the IMO there... as I said, I'm certainly far from knowing it all....
 
i am coding now some languages like c++, java, c#, php, etc.. but i realized that i really like the .net framework and its documentation, the decission for c# was clear from beginning because of its tidiness of code. But also some speed testings showed that c# is very fast and i dont think it is just another c-style language, if you read something about windows longhorn then you also often hear c#, if it is an article for developers :), that shows that ms have a bigger aim for c# and the wouldnt have spend 1 billion USD on .net framework if they just wanted to do their own "java" or whatever people might call c#
i never found a way which would lead me to vb6 or vb.net. I always was against coding in delphi and vb made a similar impression to me, so there is no chance for coding in vb for me, maybe this will change in september when i start working, but at the moment i feel quite well coding in c#

so i just can sumarize that c# isnt just another c-style or java-like language and i think ms had some intention building c#
 
But I think if you like VB, and the programming bug gets you, you'll move into C# with the proper motivation... it's the natural move I think, and after doing C# for a while it just seems so much more natural than VB
Click to expand...
Perhaps I have some 'splainin to do:
I wasn't insulting C*, I was insulting this newbization of VB and, while I am used to VB, it seems like they just won't make it as powerful as C#, C++, and other .NET languages..., so that every person around the world can say in unison "VB can't do this...".
But that's just my 2c :)
Happy coding!
 
The VB6 world was definetly, in the majority, an amatuer scene. VB6 is just so easy to pick up and code with.

I really think that this has changed in VB.NET. Its much more structured and complicated, and most of those casual programmers will find vb.net too complicated.
 
that shows that ms have a bigger aim for c# and the wouldnt have spend 1 billion USD on .net framework if they just wanted to do their own "java" or whatever people might call c#
Click to expand...

The vantages of the .NET framework are many fold actually. My ears began to perk up in its early stages when I heard about the versioning system that would be employed to help end the agony of conflicting DLLs.

With the looming release someday of the 64 bit chips, the platform also provides a way to help migrate programs to that environment.

For those who want to explore the realm of theory, it does also provide a way to 'turn on a dime' if the Linux world gains further speed and begins to be used more commonly on the desktops. Since C++ has been ported to .NET, MS could readily re-write their office suite in either that or C# to provide an alternative to the Star Office and Open Office suites that run on Java under Linux. I realize the heated debate regarding if Linux could ever gain ground on the desktop, and I don't mean to start a debate here as that is not my intent. If you were in the MS position and your office suite could become less of a seller if another operating system became prominent, and you had no plans or way to quickly provide your product for the new environment, you would be in a world of hurt. So there is nothing wrong with making plans to handle the situation if it arises and I see .NET as a way of doing that.

So there are plenty of reasons why the need for .NET and this may not be all of them. I just happen to see these reasons as some pretty big motivators myself.
 
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